What Is Reasonable to Expect??

Am I missing something? If he's home by 11, and sleeping by 12-1 am, he could just get up at 10 for a normal day and have waaaaaaay more sleep than either my husband or I get. And my husband starts work at 5:00 AM and he's in bed by 9:30.....and he's 50!

He can sleep with a two year old and a baby in the house?!?

Seriously, though, he needs 13 hours of sleep a day? Aside from not interacting with the kids, what exactly DOES he contribute to the household beside a paycheck? I would have a major problem with this.

I read your last post too and I think your DH is being a needy baby. He is pulling away cuz he can't cope. The only thing I can think for you to do is to leave him alone. I know it seems that it's the opposite of what you should do but he needs to get through this himself. When he texts, ignore the phone. When he whines only say "wow that sucks" then go about your business.

The biggest thing with this is to let go of expecting any help from him at all. Let him sleep all day, be civil, and do it yourself. If you need help seek it elsewhere. Like get a moms helper to come in for a couple of hours. Shower when kids are sleeping, let go of the house. Let him work this out without being able to blame you.

Try and convince him he needs counseling. Doubt he will listen.

My DH pulled something similar. It really empowered me to do it myself and never expect any help from him. The worst thing was people saying "he needs to step up" "how can he do this" "I would never let my DH do this". Ha you can't force him to do what you want but you can figure out how to live your life. My DH came around, maybe yours will.

If you want him to start showing up for work at home-start hiring some help!

i would think sleeping from 12 or 1am to 9amish or 10 would be fine (and more sleep then most people get) and then he interacts with your daughter until she takes her nap and then you two get quality time, same thing that would happen if he worked first shift, some time with the baby and then time with you while she sleeps.
I would have a heart to heart and tell him she needs more time with him to bond with him ecspecially now that there is a baby and her time with mom is splitm and that he is an important part of her life and upbringing.
Maybe if he starts having one on one time with her outside he'll learn to love it. My ex needed ideas. I would set up activities (set up paints and crafts glue, ribbons, playdough, whatever I could think she;d love.)or give him ideas of places to take her (library for story time, park) and afte a few weeks he loved it and would ask to take her and ask for ideas. Some adults aren't good with "inside play" and J. get bored of interacting with little kids and need ideas of things to do with kids. I can;t stand to J. sit still and play imaginary games or aything like that but I love interacting and going to the park or helping with crafts or reading.

I expect my husband to be a partner in parenting my 5 year old D. He works during the day and I'm a stay at home Mom. (Who will work part-time when D goes to K). I take care of most of the domestic stuff, shopping, meals, cleaning, etc. And I take care of my D. But I have a night off (Thurs) that my Husband cooks and I can get a break over the weekend if I need it. He helps out any way that's needed. He has his routine with her too. A story at night, walks, etc. Although I do most of the caregiving, Because I'm home- My H can do everything -cook, give baths, and knows her routine. What if something happened and he had to take care of D? I think you should iron out some kind of plan with your H. The odd hours are tough. I have a friend who's H is a doctor and has weird hours. This is a common problem. Of course you need a break! Try to approach it as positively as possible. Make a specific request. Like could you help with the Kids while I go shopping on Weds? Let's do something as a family on your day off, etc. And make it a routine. There is no reason on God's green earth that your Husband can't sleep from 2AM-10AM and parent before work. (He probably needs some unwinding time after work) It's the opposite of most H that help out after work. But he should have time before his shift to help out for a couple hours. Plus why should you be expected to work all day without help? Good Luck.

He definately should be interacting w/ the kids. Right now, they are both home during the day but in about 2 short years, one will be starting school (and if he doesn't see her before school he wouldn't see her AT all).

You say he works second shift so I am guessing he gets home between 11 pm & midnight (evey company has different hours so I am just guessing). I am not a napper so getting up in the morning and laying back down to nap when the little one naps would just be futile (even if tired) because I wouldn't be able to just get back up and go to work. For now at least, I would suggest that he sleep in but maybe get up mid to late morning (8-10 am) which would have allowed him to get a full nights sleep and have time w/ the kids before nap and then he would have 12-2 to interact with you and get ready for work. If he worked 1st shift he would have dinner, time, and bedtime w/ them...now it would be time, lunch, and naptime with them (same concept just in reverse).

Once you have one in school, he may want to consider getting up in time for breakfast w/ both. At that point, you may find it easier as schedules will have already been established and you will just be tweaking them.

I am a SAHM and dh works 2nd also. he normally goes to bed around 1ish he is home by 1130 unless he is asked to work over. I usually give him till 10am at the latest to sleep in. He will spend some time playing with dd when she comes home from school at 11am we do a sit down dinner around 1130 everyday and he will hang with her until he has to get ready to leave. Then weekends we spend time as a family getting projects done or just chilling out. Can you afford to put your 2yo into preschool 2-3x a week? that may help your sanity and give your dd some release of her own. Have you communicated to him not nagged him about what his involvement should be for work days? He maybe depressed has he had his test levels checked? that can play a huge factor in his mood and physical involvment. gl

My husband used to work this shift years ago and it is a hard one to work. He couldn't fall asleep well, had to 'unwind' and that took time even though he was home or in bed. Then you are just 'off' from those hours. He got up around 10 or 11 a.m. usually and there isn't much he could do in that amount of time. He had to leave by 2 p.m. It was not a good time for the kids or him or me. I was so glad when he found another job. Is there a chance that your husband could get a day shift or find another job and I know the job market is not good? That would be so much better for you all.

wow, sounds like some real hostility and frustration here, on both sides. like you i'd be very upset at the lack of interest in the babies. i just don't get parents who have kids and aren't involved with them. at all. and clearly you need a break, and some help.
yet i also think it's pretty harsh to say he's just lying in bed all day. 2nd shift is brutal, and few cope with it well.
i can't really answer your question because my dh was in from the beginning. i didn't have to expect help from him, because it wasn't 'help', they're his kids too.
sounds to me a ground-up restructuring is necessary, so that you both clearly understand what you expect from this partnership. is he as dissatisfied as you are?
khairete
S.

When does he get home? My cousin and her DH have arranged that when he first comes home from his shift, he stays up for an hour or two. He takes care of their 2 yr old when she gets up - does breakfast and play time so that 1. her mom (who has health concerns of her own) can sleep and 2. he gets to see his kid. When Cousin gets up, he goes to bed til shortly before he has to eat, shower and go to work again.

My husband works a 9-5. When he comes home, he will interact with the family, make dinner (he's frankly better than I am), play with DD. We might have other stuff to do, too, but he spends a little bit of time reading to DD or playing whatever game she's invited him to play with her, and gives her a bath half the time. Tonight, for example, I have a meeting and he will man the house and take care of DD.

I think the bigger issue is that your DH isn't interested in the children and he would rather have his time vs helping you out. He can get up when it suits him and taking care of the kids doesn't suit him. If he does nothing child-related, not even interacting with them when he could (nevermind letting you get a shower - I know how that goes with shampoo on your head and one ear on the kids) then something is wrong, IMO. If it's timing, talk to him more about the interaction when he first gets home. Maybe you can compromise on an hour when he first gets in vs expecting him to be up very long after a long night. How much time does he see them after 2? Does he leave very quickly? My grandmother worked 2nd shift and would nap after lunch, get up around 2 and leave by 3:30.or 4. We saw her for a bit during that time, but she was also ironing her uniform, etc. (The three local grandkids were there after school most days.)

Since you have a baby, I'm guessing that you do get to see him without the kids, but what's your quality time like, too?

Sounds like you need to have a really deep one-on-one with your husband.

If he doesn't want to share in his kids life- that will be HIS loss - you need to tell him that. Being a weekend dad sucks.

If my husband worked second shift (my first husband worked 1st, 2nd and mids) but always managed to get up and have breakfast with our daughter before she went to school.

After a mid - he would stay up until she was gone and wake up when she got home.

For a 2nd shift? He woke up for breakfast - worked out - then went back to bed until 1300. Up again.

My first husband was a lot of things - but he was/is a good dad. He had our disagreements about child rearing (he wanted to be her friend and have her call him his first name...I said NO FREAKING WAY!! You are the PARENT not the friend - he agreed after about 3 months of discussion).

Tell him what you expect. Tell him that his children and you NEED him. He needs to pull his selfish (my opinion) butt out of bed and interact with the kids so they KNOW him - not just on the weekends!!!

What do I expect from my husband? he knows it. He chose family over career. He coached little league, was a cub scout leader and is now an assistant boy scout leader.

Well, you're supposed to be equal parents. You never have the choice over whether you're a mother. He doesn't have the choice on when to be a father either.

Eliminate the option of "asking" him to watch his own children. It's time to make "I'm going to ____ now/in five minutes so I need you to watch the kids. It's time to get up. They need you to be awake to properly care for them."

If you can journal your kids' routines, especially the baby, that will help not only you but it'll help him see what's next to be done when the baby fusses or cries and you're busy. "I'm in the shower, sorry. Check the journal."

When you asked this question before you got a lot of great advice.
Then you posted that you got "secret revenge" on him by cooking something that makes him gag and putting wet towels in with his work clothes.
I'm not sure how old you are but you both sound really immature.
If you want him to "man up" then you need to do the same. Stop complaining and TAKE a break! You said in your other post you can't leave him with the baby on the weekend because you are breastfeeding. Why not? My son was exclusively breastfed, he didn't even take a pacifier, and I was able to leave for an hour or two to go work out or go to the store.
You need to have a serious adult conversation with your husband about BOTH of your expectations. You say you don't understand him. Ask him WHY he doesn't want to spend more time with the kids. I hate to say it but a lot of fathers just aren't that hands on, especially when the kids are little. You may just need to accept that.

I think the schedule that you outlined is totally reasonable and I think he's being a lazy bum and I'd be really disgusted. I don't work outside of the home and that is almost exactly *my schedule* (shifted ahead an hour or so). I go to bed about 11-11:30, and my son wakes up at 6:00. If he's not truly ill, then I'd be really pissed that he wasn't engaged more.

People who work 2nd or 3rd shift often still feel tired, even if they get a regular 8 hours of sleep--that's because most people are designed in sleeping at night, so sleeping 8 hours during the day is not as restful & reviving.

However, that being said, there is no reason that he can't participate. Instead of doing nightly dinner as a family, for example, it could be an early lunch together as a family.

If he sleeps from midnight or 1 am to 9 or 10 am, then he should be up and dressed and able & willing to play with the kids for at least an hour before lunch.

Try to come at this from an understanding point of view---don't be judgemental. However, do stress to him that a) this time is going to slip by very fast and he'll never have the chance to snuggle with his little ones again at this age, and he'll miss it when they are teens and don't want the snuggles, and b) if he continues to be an absent father, when he finally decides they are the right age to be more fun (or whatever his argument is), they will have already decided that they don't want a relationship with him. Ask him to check his schedule and figure out, based on his 8-to-9 hours per night that needs, when would be a good time for him to spend some time with them. Let him know that even an hour would be a godsend to you, and very much appreciated (and then when he finally does it, even if he's doing it begrudgingly or under duress, make sure you show your appreciation, in whatever way will mean the most to him (hint, hint)).

If he won't set a time to be together as a family and/or watch the kds, then schedule something where you have to be out of the house during a time when he's home & awake. Let him know that you'll be going to X 1x per week (or 3x per week or whatever) and that he'll need to watch the kids. Remind him the day before and then the day of, leave and tell him you'll see him in an hour.

I soooo understand what you are going through. My DH worked 2nd shift for years! I hated it.

I would tell him that you really need him to help out- taking care of a 2.5 yo and a 2 month old, on top of everything else you do, is work too. You need a break. I think it's perfectly reasonable for him to get 7 or 8 hrs. of sleep and then get up and spend time with you and the kids. If he's up by 9, that would give you time to get things done. Why in the name of heaven does he need a 2-3 hr. nap?!! Do you get that much sleep? I highly doubt it.

Be as sweet as pie when you talk to him about it, but don't back down!!!
Stand up for yourself!!

This is a simple question. It's about your husband WANTING to be a dad. If he wants to be a part-time dad, that's his problem. You can tell him that this will backfire on him. He won't have much pull over the kids if he's only active part time.

I'm divorced now and have been for almost 10 years. My ex husband was a radio DJ. He had to be to work at 4AM and he was home around 11AM. By that time, the boys were already over at Nana and Papa's house as I had to work. He would sleep until 3PM and then go pick up the boys from his grandparents house. We were VERY fortunate to have family be able to help us with the boys.

Tell him again what you expect. Tell him the future problem he will face if he continues to not play an active daily role in his kids lives. Wake him up and tell him he needs to play the kids while you shower or whatever you need to do. Don't let him slack.

What times does he have to leave for work and get home?

I am a night person. I stay up until 4 and 5 am on a regular basis...

I have a hard time winding down once I come in from work late at night when I have worked that late shift. I tried to explain it like this. When you come home from work at 5 pm are you ready for bed? Do you go straight to bed and sleep until a designated time then set your alarm to get up? No, you have time to unwind, watch TV, read, get on the computer, take a shower, etc...

If he is going directly to bed when he gets off work then after he sleeps, UNDISTURBED, for a full 8 hours he should probably be getting enough rest.

We all know what it's like to be woken up every little bit when we have little ones so you know what I mean when I say uninterrupted sleep. If he is waking every little bit by kiddo or you, then he is not getting rested. He is getting choppy sleep and that is not rejuvenating.

I would also suggest he talk to the doc about a sleep study to see if he has sleep apnea. The Bi-pap or other device they sleep with really helps them get the oxygen they need while they are sleeping and it sure makes a difference in their sleep patterns.

So, my advice. If he needs the rest he needs the rest. If he truly is going to bed and sleeping soundly, consistantly, without interruption from 1am to 2 pm something is wrong. No one needs that much rest.

If he were winding down and going to bed around 4 or 5 like I would on his schedule then I would expect to sleep until the after noon every day.

His sleep pattern should be the same consistently. If he doesn't work his body is still used to the sleep pattern so even if he doesn't work that night he is still going to sleep his normal pattern.

It is completely ridiculous for him to be in bed all day. I would let him sleep until 9 or 9:30, then wake him up. there is no reason he should sleep all day when you are doing everything with the kids by yourself. I would be livid if I were you.

My husband does not 'help' with our son anymore than I 'help' with him. We both care for him equally. Neither one of us ever sleeps all day. We share preparing meals, cleaning (we do have a cleaning lady once every 2 weeks), getting DS dressed, putting him to bed, taking him to the doctor, dentist, parties, etc and taking care of the house. We both work full time and have since long before DS was born. We shared equally then too - don't know why having a child would change that.

You should expect him to be a partner to you and a parent to his kids. I know his schedule makes things a bit difficult, but if his family was a priority, your husband would figure out a way to spend time with you and your kids.

Just to share how things work for us, my husband is gone for work from 7 am until 6 pm each week day. He spends time with our kids every night from the time he gets home until they go to bed around 8 pm. He puts the 11 month old to bed every night, and the 4 year-old to bed at least half the time. If the baby is awake before my husband has to leave for work he gets the baby up, changed and fed then brings him in to me at 7 when he leaves.

What time does he get home from work and go to sleep? That info would help.

Recommended sleep is 7-9 hours/night, he's getting 13-14. Sounds like he's getting too much sleep and that is making him tired, for one. Too much sleep will do that. Has he had a physical to rule out fatigue syndrome? If all is fine, then yes, just like a husband who is home in the evening, he should plan on spending family time with his family. Mine picks up my LO from daycare on conference nights when they occur and takes her home and all it involves, does baths, dinners, and he pretty much gets her completely ready every morning before we both go to work. I do drop off/pickup. More time and logistics-based than anything but we both do what needs to be done and work the fun in, reading stories, etc. And yes, he is with her while I shower, run an errand, etc.

personally i think if hes in bed by 1 at the latest if he can sleep until 9 or 10am thats a good 8/9hrs of sleep he can wake up and spend the rest of the time with the kids until 2 wen he needs to get ready for work .. its not like hes working all night .. before i read the bottom part of your question i was assuming being that u said he slept until 2 that he worked night shift hours.. being that hes out of work by 11 theres no reason why he needs to sleep til 2pm

Even though I was home for the first 7 mos with my son and my husband worked, he still played with and fed or son.. He felt that although he might be tired at times, he still wanted to be around our son as much as possible .. knowing of course that it all flies by so quickly.. Maybe if you can stress to your husband that he can never get back these precious times with his kids, he might then want to do more... My son is now ten , and to this day, we still feel that all time spent with him is precious .. so tired or not, we like to do as many family oriented things as possible.. Maybe you can gently help your husband gather a new perspective with regard to the kids.. really, I think when people become parents, it has to be 50 50 .. at least to some degree... do you know other dads who spend a lot of time with their kids.. can you get that guy to talk to your husband.. maybe he needs another man's perspective... a man whom tired or not, devote as much time to his kids as possible..

I wish you and your family the best..

I agree with you...he needs to step up and if he doesn't get his full 8 hours, to dang bad...not many parents do! When my kids were little, my hubs and I worked opposite shifts...so I would get the kids up at 330am, take em to work (we worked at same facility) and he would get them from me and bring them back home and feed them, play w/ them, do whatever he needed to (this was in the am right after his 12 hour shift, mind you) and he would then, get them to whoever was watching them by 10ish, then get s few hours of sleep, up by 2 or 3, then back to work.

It CAN be done and is so important to the kids that he is involved! I hope you guys are able to find a way to make this work.

If it makes you feel any better, I think this is kind of common among men. It's reasonable for you to expect more, but I wouldn't be surprised if it turns into a battle. Hopefully other moms have a good suggestion for you.

I always did way more than either of my husbands.