I am hoping that this will not turn into a long post, but I really am in need of some advice.
I have been living apart from my husband since 2004, he moved to another state and started a new family there, but we are still married. He has not seen our 2 children in over 5 years, they are now, 9 and 11. The few visits that he made with them before he stopped coming were often very short and never more than maybe 3 hours. Our daughter (now 9) was 2 when he left and she does not remember anything about him, and our son (now 11) was 4 when he left and honestly does not like his father and does not want anything to do with him (this is because he went to stay with his father in 2005 and had a horrible experience there, CPS was called and his father brought him home and the case was closed, but I was never told what had happened, or why they were called).
I really do want my kids to know their father, and have tried to get him to stay in touch with them over the years, but have failed. There was a time when he tried to move back to town, and I even offered my house to him and his fiancee and her son until they found a place, but he refused, and left again. After that, I paid for an 800 number for our house so that he could call them whenever he wanted without having to pay the bill himself, but he never used it, not even once and so I got rid of it after a year. I tried to get him to set up a Skype account so that they could chat, but that did not happen. I set up an email for them to be able to email him and him to email them, but it was never used. For a long while he refused to give me a phone number or address so I could not have them call him, or write to him. His mother finally broke down and gave my daughter his number and she tried to call him several times and left messages that were never answered. Our son has given up on his father, and it breaks my heart, but our daughter is curious about him and wants to get to know him.
Over the years we have had several conversations about the best custody arrangement, he wanted 6 months of the year for a long time, and I would not agree to having them pulled out of school half way through the year and placed in another school in another state. So, I told him I would agree to let him take them part of the summer and any school visits that were long enough to make the trip worth it to all of them. For years this was not good enough for him and so he didn't see them at all and rarely talked to them (they have talked to him maybe 4 times on the phone from our house, but his mom does call him sometimes and let them talk to him), though I never stopped him from coming to visit them, calling them, or even writing to them. When he did visit them, he would take them to the park, or to his mom's and that was fine, all I asked was that they stay in the state.
Finally in 2008 he agreed that summers and breaks was enough, and asked if he could take them for the summer. I told him that our son was having trouble in school and may have to attend summer classes, but that I would let him know after I had a meeting with the teacher and that if it were possible for them to be back in time for our daughter to go on her girl scout camping trip, because she had been working hard to be able to go and was very excited for it. Well, me asking for that was too much to ask of him and he said he wasn't taking them, and he didn't. The next year I asked when he wanted to take them and he told me that he did not have the money to take them, and I dropped it. So, last year I asked again and was told that he wanted to give up his rights and that I needed to have the papers drawn up and he would sign them. I asked him repeatedly if he was sure and told him that I did not want him to do this, and if he was dead set on it, I would find out what needed to be done. Well, when he heard that he could not just give up his rights in the divorce papers he flipped out and said he no longer wanted to do it, and went back to his wanting them 6 months of the year. I have not changed my position on that, so it did not happen. This summer I emailed him and asked when he wanted to take the kids because my parents wanted to have a week visit with them toward the end of summer and needed to put in for time off of their jobs, and after months with no replies from him, I went ahead and told my mom to pick a day. About 3 weeks later he finally told me he wanted them for July and I told him that my mom had already taken time off work and asked if the end of June would work, and I asked if 2 or 3 weeks would be enough time as they had not seen him in years and I was afraid of them getting there and wanting to come home right away, and he again flipped and said it was not worth it to him, and refused to take them or come to visit. (Our daughter also had called him from his mom's house and told him that she wanted him to come and visit before she went to his house, after which, he sent me a nasty text message asking if I was paying for him to come here for a 20 minute visit and that I was rotten for making her do that, but I honestly had no idea she was calling him, and all I had done was tell her that her dad wanted her to come visit him at his house)
Now, I have filed for custody and divorce and have had him served with papers, because he refused to accept them by certified mail. My question is, am I wrong for wanting him to reconnect with the children before he takes them out of the state? I have asked him to call them once a week to just talk but he has not called them here at all, his mom does call him while the children are at her house and have them talk to him sometimes, but it seems like all he talks about is this park by his house and how they should come see it. They do not know anything about him, his fiancee, or his 3 other children there. I want him to get to know them and for them to get to know him, but it seems like he is bribing them trying to get them to beg me to let them go. So, what I am asking for in the custody hearing is for him to take time and get to know them, through phone calls and letters, visits here in their hometown, and even Skype so they can see his house and his kids and his fiancee before they are just thrown into that situation. Is this a good arrangement or are they just going to give him visitation out of state right away?
We have had 2 mediations now, he did not show up for the second one, and I was granted full custody. He is appealing that decision, but I am in the process of hiring a lawyer. I have spoken to one at length and he has assured me that the most my ex can hope for is a gradutated visitation plan, which would start with calls and then go to supervised visits, and then unsupervised in our county then he would have overnights here, and then maybe he would get to take them out of state, the lawyer assured me he would have hoops to jump through to prove himself. I am struggling to get the money together for this lawyer, but I am going to do it, because I see it as the best money that I will ever spend. Guaranteeing my children are protected and will not be hurt...is priceless to me!
With him living out of state, I can't imagine any judge awarding 6 months to each parents (in state would be odd enough). I can't believe custody was not established long ago even if the divorce wasn't.
You are not wrong for wanting them to reconnect. You have been ridiculously more than fair and accommodating.
It does no good to beat a dead horse. He left --- he has another family --- he doesn't want the children you share with him---let it go.
Get the divorce taken care of, he probably won't show. Custody though usually taken care of in the same hearing is a separate issue. He probably won't show for that either. You will probably be granted sole custody with no visitation for him since he will not agree on any offers you have made. Visitation can be re-opened if either of you want to in the future. I would ask for child support and ask to have that taken out of his check before he sees it.
Please see the reality of the situation he abandoned you and your children. Go into counseling for you and the kids and learn to deal with it.
I wouldn't push any visits.
From what you wrote, it sounds like you have given him many options & chances. It does not sound like he has fallen through on any of them.
How far away does he live?
It sounds like he doesn't really want to see them anyway and I would not
want to put my kids in harms way as he has not had any contact w/them
aside from the calls from his mom's house.
I wouldn't really be comfortable w/the kids being alone w/him since he's
been absent for so long. How about just dropping it to see where it goes
if anywhere? He'd have to be the one to follow up anywhere. You can
tell your kids you tried which it sound like you have. It seems he's not
really that anxious to really follow through.
Sorry you & your kids are going through this. Your son doesn't seem too
anxious to see him/be alone w/him & your daughter is curious. How
about leaving things are for now & if they want to know him when they're older & he's more willing...then it will/can happen?
I wish you the best. I'm sure this is a trying time.
He doesnt sound like a very interested dad. I hope he's being a good dad to the new ones he has brought into the world. He sounds pretty distracted and probably cant multitask two families.
I suspect he's afraid he's going to have to pay child support and that is why he is going to ask for a big visitation so he can keep the amount down. It does not sound like he's interested in the kids, only the money and the inconvenience.
I think judge will give you sole custody but a visititation arrangement is going to have to be made and kept. I would work out a reasonable schedule that you can live with. Do keep in mind that visitation doesnt always work out with your current local plans, you and the kids will have to learn to be flexible and spontaneous at times.
I applaud the fact that you dont want him to relinquish his rights, better for the kids that he doesnt. I would hate knowing one of my parents gave up on me completely.
You've written a pretty succinct time line, it would be good to share that in court to give the judge an idea of how things have been for the last 5 years.
Good luck.
And, no, I wouldnt send my kids to a strangers house. Maybe you can arrange a motel in town while they stay a night or two with him, just in case it goes awry?
I tried for years to facilitate a relationship between my son and his father - and his father lived in town! The man was not interested - though he lived with a woman who had three daughters for several years and was an active participant in their lives. When my son was 8 his father popped back into the picture and I once again tried my darnedest to get them together - it resulted in the three of us doing activities together which got to be beyond my comfort zone. Once I backed out of the activities they stopped - the man didn't know how to be with his son without me there to facilitate.
This on and off again relationship with his father had a negative impact on my son. So at 12 he attended therapy to help him deal with this. Now, at 15 he is rather ambivalent about his father. They have a better relationship as his father is more interested in a teen age boy and is actually able to figure out things for them to do together - but my son now really doesn't care and is more interested in what he get his father to buy him. Lovely, right?
This is a long way to say - let the man go. If he has consistently proven to be unreliable, manipulative, and uninterested in his children do not continue to force a relationship. It damages children to be repeatedly rejected by a parent. If your children.
Document, document, document, get a pit bull attorney and go for the most limited visitation schedule possible. Find out what the CPS issue was from years ago - it may have a huge bearing on his right to unsupervised visitation. Ask for a clause in the agreement that states that no persons of the opposite sex can spend the night in the house when the minor children are present (mine has one and it helped prevent my son from meeting the parade of girlfriends that his father had) - in your case, since the Ex lives with another woman and is not married then that easily prevents overnight visits - until he marries at least.
But my best advice it to let him go - don't force visits, emails, phone calls, Skype anything. It all just gives him further opportunities to reject the children.
Good Luck
God Bless
Based on my experience I suggest that the court will order that he get to know them before taking them out of state. It's not psychologically wise to just send them to stay with someone they don't know. I would consult with a child psychologist so that I'd have a better understanding of how is the best way to handle this
I would get an attorney and ask for sole custody and no visitation. Based on his history you just might get it. I understand wanting them to know their father but after 5 years of trying to make it happen it's time to give up. IF something were to change in the future you can still get them together with their father without having the courts involved.
If there is court ordered visitation try to get the order to state specific dates and times so that their can be limited amount of time waiting and hoping for it to happen.
If they were to visit in his home, he would have to pay for their transportation. Is he willing to do that? Perhaps he's not able to expand his view to include paying his own way to your home but would pay their way?
Above all, do make sure that, if there is an order for visitation, that he does have to take time to get to know them before they go out of state, away from you, their source of security. Consult an attorney. I do think it's highly likely that the judge would order this. I think it's also possible that he would not order visitation in the decree.
it is so sad that you are the one making this huge effort for him to have time with your kids, trying to set up visits, phone calls, etc and he just sits back like the big jerk that he is and complains how it "isnt fair to him". I'm sorry, but who gives a flying "F" what is fair to him or what he wants???? he is the one who left, he is the one who started a new family, he is the one who refuses to compromise to to try to come up with a plan that works for everyone. I would stop trying. I would have the whole thing dealt with by the lawyers. I would do everything in my power to have his rights terminated. I do NOT think it is a good idea for them to just out of the blue be sent to his house with all these new people to spend time with a dad they dont even know. It would probably be super traumatic for them. I am soooooooooooooooooo sorry you are all having to go through this, I just cannot comprehend parents who ditch their kids. If there is no way to keep him away for good then I suggest doing everything you can to make it a slow process to get everyone used to the idea, even their step-siblings would probably have a really hard time dealing with these new kids they dont know. sucky situation all the way around!
First of all, you have been a great mom in all the efforts you have made to get this a-hole to see his kids.
Sorry, but this guy is a jerk. My answer is conditional on the fact that I assume your kids are in no danger when they see him (abduction or something).
Your kids are old enough for you to sit them down, tell them the facts, and let them decide. "I'm sorry guys, that you don't have the greatest father in the world. He loves you in his own way, I guess, but he's a difficult and unreliable person. His on and off behavior has hurt your feelings over the years. But you are old enough now that you can decide if you want to take the good with the bad. Are you interested in seeing him? How long do you want to see him for?"
Etc.
You can also use this conversation to hear their feelings about his new family and 3 kids etc., if you haven't already discussed it with them. No doubt it hurts them. But just listen and mirror their feelings. "Yeah, that must be sad," etc.
It's time to be straightforward and realistic with them about their expectations of their father. Let them decide how they want to move forward, and just make sure they know that he is a selfish person, so to keep their expectations realistic.
And on that note, there is a difference between knocking your child's parent and helping your child to understand reality. If they see him as flawed,which he certainly is, they are less likely to think that THEY are the ones with the flaws.
Treat this as if your kids were adopted, they want to know the story but they dont feel he is the parent in the same sense you are their parent, They want to know who this guy is, they don't want to live with him! Help your daughter's curiosity (that's all it is - not a deep love and desire to reconnect) by getting photos, enlisting his family to share photos and stories of him as a boy. Make a book that talks about how you and he met and dated and married, and add photos of her with her dad just after she was born. Can she get to know his parents and other relatives? Do NOT push them to visit strangers in another state. He sounds very unstable, the best thing an unstable parent can do is to let the kids be raised by someone stable. A stable person does not refuse to write or call or visit his own kids. Maybe the best thing he ever did for your kids is leave them alone. Dont tell them I tried a 1 8000 number I tried Skype, he didnt communicate! I would say "Your father has problems and thought you would be better off raised by me" it implies he loved them enough to do the right thing. My kids grew up feeling they weren't good enough for their own father and I wish I had taken them to counseling when they were your kid's age! Please take your kids to a family counselor to discuss the feelings they have.
Please review these questions with your lawyer, but in my experience, if you have no custody arrangement written, agreed upon and signed, and filed with the court, your children don't need to go anywhere. If I understand you right, you've just filed for divorce including a custody arrangement. I wouldn't arrange any visitation with their father until the court reviews your case and makes a decision.
In the meantime, please stop wasting so much energy trying to make him the father you want him to be to your children. It is not within your power to do so. It is within his, and he may throw that opportunity away. Just concentrate your energy on raising your children. This constant attempt to bring their father back into their lives has had to be hard on them. Let it go. See what the court has to say.
Family courts and judges actually have some sense of the "best interests of the children". They will not pull kids out of school and send them to another state, for instance. Strategize with your lawyer about what would be best given this man's history of neglecting his children.
Due to his bad behavior you pretty much have a slam dunk for full custody. Good thing too. I think the judge will order visitation and no matter what, if he shows up, they have to go, even if they really really really want to go to camp, or go with friends someplace. It is a court order and they don't get to choose to stay home or go, they just have to pack up and go.
One of my friends is divorced and she has a daughter who is very talented musically, she plans on getting scholarships to college on her musical talent. Each year she gets accepted into a somewhat prestigious Summer music camp that is one week long. The ex/dad has Summer visitation and it always starts on that particular week that dads visit starts. No matter how many times they go to court, how many times she has asked the judge to make him let her go to the music camp, no matter what anyone does, he wants the visit to start that week so she does not get to ever go to this music camp. It would be a wonderful addition to any college application.
He will get visitation if he wants it, if he wants to terminate his parental rights then they can do that then too, he may just balk at child support and back child support at that. They will back date it to when he stopped being their financial support. It may be in their best interest to push that idea to him and then let him suggest that he terminate.
I feel bad for your kids, truly do, kids wonder what's wrong with them so much that their own parents don't even want to be around them...I have one granddaughter that I am raising and she often cries herself to sleep wanting to see her dad. I bet she could not pick him out of a crowd. I tell her that he loves her but lives a long ways away so he can work and send money to her, he has never missed a child support payment, a past boss however did miss making the deposits and eventually he lost his business due to the crookedness. I tell her he loves her and just can't be here, he lives in Tulsa...about 125 miles away. He is often here in town and just doesn't want to see her but she'll never know that.
Get that divorce, get those parent rights taken from him and forget about him. You and your children have found a better man to have as their Daddy, because their biological Father is worse than a loser and I'd not even allow his scummy thoughts to linger and fester in your family's heart and minds.
Somewhere my response got lost. But he is not going to be the dad you want him to be. Remember actions speak louder than words and all the trying you have done has not made it so.
Use that energy and put it into your children. Keep a notebook of what you tried to do so that one day when they ask you can say that here is what I tried to do for you. Your dad was the one that did not want to do so.
Contact a lawyer and file for divorce and move on with your life(s) as he is not into you guys. Life is too short to beg people to do things that don't want to do.
My best to you.
The other S.
PS You can lead a horse to water.....
