Do not want to go into a lengthy story here so will try to summarize without leaving out too much detail:
Several years ago, my husband and I got married (we had been in a relationship for 5 years; had a child together for 3 of those years). I did not want us to go into debt on wedding bills and so I researched methodically and believed we found the ideal compromise. Beautiful wedding/reception and in a budget I could afford. We paid half down as deposit and the other half on our wedding day. We paid cash so I know for a fact that we did not need to borrow any money for it. I was mainly in charge of all of it.
It was brought to my attention the other day that our neighbor (at the time we were getting married; have moved since) loaned my husband a thousand dollars on the pretense (according to my neighbor) that it was for our wedding. I do not know why my husband would go behind my back and ask our neighbor for this money when we did not need it.
Fast forward a couple of years -- My husband's son (my stepson) was getting married to a girl he got pregnant. There was not a lot of time to prep/save up for this wedding. We did not like the bride-to-be but we were respectful of their decision. They asked if we could donate any money to/for the wedding. At the time, we were in financial straits but wanted to give something so we spent a few hundred dollars for decorations, reception food, etc. at a local bar/restaurant/dive.
It was brought to my attention recently the other day that our neighbor loaned my husband $700 on the pretense that it was going towards his son's wedding.
Neither time did my husband approach me first before going to our neighbor for these loans. On the contrary, we would at times supposedly be adamant together about NOT borrowing money from our neighbor. He has tried to meddle in our lives too much and I thought (and I thought my husband agreed or so he said he did) that if we were to ever allow him to loan us money or set up a trust fund for our son, he would feel like he had some sort of control. Let me add that our neighbor absolutely loved our son and considered himself "Uncle Val" for years and had asked if he could set up a trust fund for our son since our neighbor never had kids of his own. He was NOT poor and everything was paid off and he knew he'd be leaving a good chunk of change behind. We politely declined his offer on more than one occasion.
Now I find out our neighbor is owed $1700. These loans were not necessary, IMO, and they were not discussed with me prior to obtaining the loans. Am I just as responsible for these loans as my husband? My husband did not act as part of a team/couple because he went behind my back and asked for this money. Let me just end by saying [we] are not in a position to be able to pay him back at this time.
I do want to add that we WILL be paying our ex-neighbor back. Primarily it will come out of Tom's bank account as opposed to mine. However, I'm sure I will have to cover most of the bills until the money is all paid back. So in the long run, WE will get it paid off. Furthermore, if I do ever hear of him borrowinga good sum of money again without my knowledge (I don't mean borrowing $5 or $10 from a buddy at work for lunch or something), it WILL be a dealbreaker and we will part company. Essentially, it comes down to trust, respect, & communication issues. Those are necessary for a marriage to work. Love just isn't enough.
Ethically, yes you are responsible for these loans. I would go and talk to this man and think him for being so generous. I would also set up a payment plan even $25/month would be a show of faith. I would also ask him to not loan any more money to hubby unless he speaks to you also. Explain to him that you knew nothing of this until now and hubby should not have asked for the money.
I would think no for the $1000 and yes for the $700. I think that because the $1000 was before you were married and the $700 after.
For being your husband, you sound as if he is no longer with us and/or not a part of your life any longer. If you are still married, it would morally and ethically be your responsibility too, regardless of who borrowed. As frustrating as it may be, pay the neighbor off in payments or borrow from elsewhere to pay him back. How embarrassing, I'd be pissed!
Texas is a community property state, right? If so, then yes you would be responsible for the debt. Ethically, in my opinion, you are responsible since the debt happened during your marriage (or close enough). The issue isn't with the lender...he is owed the money. The issue is with your husband.
If you are married then you should look at it as a team. Even if he did borrow the money without telling you.
What does your husband say about borrowing the money?
If in fact you both DO owe the neighbor the money, and you cannot afford to pay him right now, then you BOTH need to go the neighbor and tell him this and try to set up some sort of pay as you go. Write it down that you will pay him X amount of money a month (whatever you can afford) to try and pay off the bill.
And in the future, I would tell my husband, and the neighbor that WE are not borrowing anymore money.
Legally, my guess is yes (although I'm not a legal expert), because you are married, and debts created while you are married usually belong to both people.
But I think that problem is small compared to the fact that your husband is lying to you about money.
There is no question that you and your husband are responsible for this debt. Sorry to see you stuck in the middle like this. I would suggest, first, to ask the neighbor to make no more loans to your husband (he should agree because he is out this $1,700.
Second, you need to resolve this issue of financial responsibility with your husband. You should try talking to him yourself. If you have difficulty with this, ask for a mediator; perhaps a counselor. I would offer that your husband wants to be more in control. Working together, he can feel respected and as a good provider.
On the off chance that your husband admits to using these funds in gambling, you will want to ask him to enroll in Gam-Anon, or Gamblers Anonymous. The best of luck to you. My prayers, today, will include you and your marriage.
Typically yes, you would be... does your neighbor have anything in writing, payment terms etc? That could help you sort things out with your husband. Hard for him to deny it if you have it in writing...
Also, you say it was brought to your attention.. who brought it to your attention, and for what purpose? Was it the neighbor owed the money, or was someone else meddling?
While you certainly need to discuss this with your husband, unless you actually have info 1st hand from the neighbor who loanded the money, be careful... you don't want to create a mountain out of $1700.
It just all sounds strange....
Good luck!
You have some great thoughts here, and in our state you would owe the debt obtained after the wedding. We are a fifty/fifty state, don't know your laws.
I am just being nosey here, how did you find out or did I miss this?
I cannot tell you how angry I started to feel towards your husband. That is definitely a betrayal.
I think you need to talk to the neighbor and you also need to confront your DH. My mom was in a similar situation and found out that her now ex-husband had hit up everyone they knew behind her back, on the pretense that it was for her. He had no plan on paying them back. He just wanted a quick buck. She found out when she asked a friend for a small loan and friend said, "I have to cut you off. You still owe me $500 from October." Mom was mortified.
So, talk to "Uncle Val" and get the skinny on everything. Lay it all out on the table. Find out why he didn't talk to you (he may have been told you approved or you wanted DH to ask) and if he considered the loan a family loan or individual loan.
Then you have to have a serious talk with DH about why he did this, what he considers the loans to be, what YOU consider the loans (his debt) and the betrayal you feel about his actions. What is HIS plan to repay it?
At the end of it all, my mom repaid the loan to the friend because she was horrified at what he'd done and knew he would not repay it. You may end up in a similar boat. When my DH divorced, he took on half the marital debts, even though they weren't all his doing. Your DH is being shifty and you need to decide what this means to you.
Technically, and probably legally, no.
California is a property state. But, when I've called credit companies to make payments etc on credit cards in my husband's name, they always tell me in their legal jargon that I am not responsible for his debt because it's in his name.
But this is not a creditor. This is your neighbor. And someone who considers himself family. So, I suggest working it out.
I would say that even though your husband didn't behave as a partner should behave that unfortunately, yes, you owe the money as a couple. Morally and legally.
To get nitpicky, it was wrong of your husband to go behind your back. It was wrong of him to lie. Do you know the reasoning as to why your husband took out these micro-loans from your former neighbor? Did your husband sign an IOU? What does your husband say about this situation? How does he plan on handling it?
I'm also wondering if finances and lies were part of the reason for the break-up of his first marriage.
You live in Texas so your properties, and all financials (everything you have saved, and everything you owe) are both of yours...unless you have a prenup and are getting a divorce.
How did you find out about these debts? Did the neighbor tell you?
If the neighbor told you, then I would talk to your husband about it. Has your husband ever done anything like this behind your back before? Do you have access to the bank accounts? Is there money missing from that account? If there is no other money missing, then remain calm when speaking with him about the repayment of the loans. If there is money missing from the bank accounts, then you have a much bigger issue with your husband and money.
Either way, legally you're responsible unless you can prove you had no idea about the loans. Talk to you husband.
If you're married, then you're responsible for his debts too. You need to have a good chat with him. He broke your trust repeatedly. Maybe your neighbor coerced him into taking money, but still, he shouldn't tell you one thing and turn around and do another. Ideally, your husband should do the extra work it takes to pay off this neighbor, but it depends on your situation. If he can pick up some OT, then he should and allocate that money away. If he can't earn more income, then can he stop doing something that would save money? I'd look at the bills and figure out how to give the neighbor whatever you can every week...even if it's $5. It lets him know you're intending to pay him back even if it's a small amount.
Both legally and morally I believe you are just as much responsible for repayment.
However, between you and hubby, it is his debt and his responsibility to figure out how to pay it back.
If I were you, I would leave it to hubby and not help him figure it out at all. I do think you need to let hubby know you know about the debts and ask him to please not incur anymore debt, especially with your former neighbor, without discussing it with you. It's just does not make for a good marriage for one spouse to have secrets from the other, especially about something like finances and debts.
I'd tell your neighbor "Well then you need to take it up with my husband."
Does your husband agree or deny that he owes your neighbor money?
If your neighbor took your husband to court, then a judge may make him pay if there's evidence of an agreement to repay. But I don't see how the neighbor could rightfully take YOU to court, as you were not part of any agreement nor did you even ever touch/receive any money. No I don't see how you are responsible whatsoever.
Give your husband heck and then pay back the neighbor - you can take out a small personal loan from a bank and then make payments on it.
No matter how much money the neighbor has, and even if your husband did not consult you, you still need to make sure he is paid back.
Legally or morally? I guess yes, you are in either case. I mean, if your neighbor suddenly came calling on the loan you wouldn't very well say "that's your problem and not mine, good luck" right?
What the heck did you husband spend the money on!?!
And yes definitely let your neighbor know that you did not know about either loan and politely request that he not lend any more money to your husband and that you will pay him off over time.
Your husband has a lot of explaining to do!
I think the real issue here is your husband going behind your back.
Was all of this, on paper with your Husband????
Did he sign anything?????
Did the neighbor document all of this????
Is your name, on any of these papers???
Did your Husband tell the neighbor that YOU also are accepting the "loan?" and gave a go ahead for you????
It is weird that this neighbor, who is a non-relative and is not family... tries to get himself on financial relations, with your son and your Husband...
Unless you're planning on divorcing your husband, I think it's immaterial if this is your husband's or both your debt... If you're planning on divorcing, I guess state law about community property comes into play but on the other hand, if there's nothign in writing, I wonder if your neighbor would pursue the debt and/or if he could prove anything. And would he say that it was a loan to you AND your husband or just your husband... But do you think he or your husband actually plan on this money being repaid? I wonder if you husband took it as a "loan" but given Uncle Val was always offering money, never planned on repaying it and that's fine with Uncle Val. You say he has plenty of money. Might be like when I was a kid and "borrowed" money from my parents... So I'd worry less about the actual overhang of this money and more about whether your husband has done it with other people and/or more with Uncle Val and/or why he's lied about it. I'd be most upset that he on the surface agreed you would not borrow money but then did it anyway. If it'd never been discussed and he did it, not good but men have their pride etc. But you did specifically talk about this...
You need to find out what he is doing with the money and if he owes other people as well. Don't just tell the neighbor not to loan him money. Tell him about his deceitfulness so he sees who he is dealing with. He may be a softy when it comes to your husband.
If your husband will not tell you what he did with the money, then you need to get some counseling right away. If he won't go, it's a deal breaker. If he will keep that info from you, he may have other secrets that are undermining your marriage and will ultimately cost you in more ways than just financially.
Thanks for the responses, ladies. I appreciate the feedback. We will definitely be having a lengthy discussion as soon as my MIL leaves to go back home (she's been staying with us all summer as "Granny Nanny"--she's NOT doing it for free as she needs the money and we're happy to pay her vs. a stranger to watch our son). However, I don't want her having to deal with the unnecessary stress as this is between me and her son.
I believe the ultimate route to keep our marriage together is to have separate bank accounts (no more joint accounts) and he be responsible for certain bills and I'll be responsible for other bills. I don't want to walk away from this marriage saying that I didn't try everything to make it work. Clear conscience sort of thing, especially since we have a child together.
You're married; it's a joint debt.
Yes you are, if you were to divorce today the court would give half the debt to you.
California is the only state where you wouldn't, you don't appear to live in California.
Unfortunately, Texas is a community property state so any debt or assets obtained during the marriage are jointly yours. I wish it wasn't community property as I don't believe another adult should be held responsible for the bad decisions of another adult even if you're married.
If you are married, you are responsible for the debt. If you should divorce or if your husband should pass away that becomes a different issue.
I agree with the pp that stated that the $1K would not be your responsibility since that was before marriage, but the $700 would be since that after marriage. And I can't believe after all this time your husband hasn't started paying the neighbor back for the $1K? Does your husband know you know he's borrowed both monies? Is he the one that informed you after the fact? Is there a little riff now between you two because of this situation? I would also be pissed!
