At My Wits End with My Daughter and Her Room

My daughter is 8 also. She is just now cleaning her room on her own initiative sometimes, but I still often guide and help sometimes. I like much of the advice you got below but want to emphasize my daughter didn't get this way without a lot of guidance, sometimes frustration and early on, tears as we both learned about this. Little kids either don't like to part with ANYTHING or she's got a lot of her fathers gene's :-).

What I used to do is ask her to clean either for a set time limit (5-15 minutes) and sometime help her decide if it wasn't clear where the home was for some of the things she was asked to put away. Every once in awhile I'll have a contest with her to see who can put away more stuff in 5 minutes.

About the trash bags.....I hope you aren't just tossing the stuff. I'd say hang on to it and when she asks for something back, decide where it will "live" and be put away after she's done using it. If there's something that needs to be put away first also ask her to do that before she gets the item out of the bag. Try not to be emotional. I find making games of it helps. I much prefer putting things away in a fun contest than with tension and the feeling of drudgery. Take care

I would say keep the party and stick with the removal of items and few clothing choices ... my mom and I had this battle and for me, it was the one thing/space I felt I had total control over; so see if you can determine any underlying causes before just saying she is messy!

I've trash bagged bedrooms before .....& it works! Sometimes kids just can't see "the forest for all of the trees".....to use an old phrase.

Sooo, let's start at the beginning: is her room supplied with an adequate amount of storage....both large-style & small? Has she been taught to divide & conquer, to find "like" items & put them together? Does she have bookcases & shelves to stack the individual items.....& does she also have clear plastic shoe boxes to store all of the little items?

Next up: instead of allowing her to get to this point, when she's in the room - check on her regularly. Be consistent! Check every 15 minutes & make sure she's not allowed to fall back into her bad habits. When you're dealing with children her age.....it's all about how the parents parent! If you allow her to make a mess, then she'll never learn to put away as she goes! & don't shoot commands from the doorway....she'll never listen/get it that way.

& I want to be very clear: let her play, let her have FUN. But when she's finished with one thing, make danged sure it's put away before she either leaves the room or moves onto another activity! That's the only way she will learn not to be a slob!

You might want to consider a Rewards Chart.....not just for the "before bedtime" check.....but also for "Morning, Afternoon, Evening". Break it into sections & she'll have a better chance at succeeding! Peace...

You have some good ideas here, just wanted to offer you a bit of encouragement too. When I was a kid my room looked just like you describe your daughter's. I literally had a path through the stuff from the door to my bed! My mom hated looking in my door because she too, couldn't stand the mess. Every once in a while I'd tackle the piles and clean up, just to have it end up a mess again - I SWEAR, I had no idea how it got that way. When you're a kid, you honestly don't pay attention to putting one shirt, two pieces of paper, a stuffed animal.... on the floor, it accumulates without you even realizing it until your mom comes in a says "Look at your ROOM! What happened in here?"
By high school I had a different colored folder for each subject, labeled down the side and front. All my books were covered and labeled with the same color it's corrosponding notebook. My homework was filed neatly, and my notes were organized by month and week. My clothes hung in my closet in color order (hangers too!) and my underwear was layed flat in the drawer. My mom's only gripe was that my bed was never made!
Now that I'm the mom, I can't seem to start my day until every bed is made ;) Just thought I'd let you know that there IS hope, she'll catch on someday, and just might end up being your most organized kid!

Does she know *how* to clean her room?

My son's room got out of control - I told him to clean it - he didn't. He got grounded. In the course of the conversation he finally admitted that he was overwhelmed by the scope of the "job". LOL His room was a disaster. And I am no Martha Stewart but it was wrecked by even my standards.

So I broke it down into smaller projects for him to do over the course of several days. It helped, a lot. By the end of the week he had a clean room. And, he has been able to keep it clean because he now knows how to manage the problem areas separately.

You don't say how old your daughter is - I think that affects their ability to clean their rooms. (Mine was 14 - so old enough to know better, I thought). Try breaking down the room cleaning into smaller pieces. (1) pick up all the laundry and put it in the hamper (2) put all the toys on the shelves (3) pick up everything under the bed, etc.

Realize that her room did not get that way in a day, so it may take more than a day for her to clean it. Once I realized that, and taught my son how to break it down, it became much less stressful for both of us. His room still looks great - in fact better than mine right now. LOL

Good Luck
God Bless

I think you are going overboard. Only 2 outfits and a pair of pajamas? How is that going to teach her how to manage her stuff.

I would go through her room with her. She obviously has a lot of clutter and junk, outgrown clothes, toys.... Help her sort it out, it's overwhelming for most adults, I'm sure she hasb't figured it out yet. Make a trash pile and recycle pile, a donation pile and a pile to keep. Once her things are whittled down, help teach her how to organize and how to maintain it. Like every night at bedtime, or before school, do a quick 5 minute cleanup. Make small rules like her bed needs to be made every morning. I don't think having storage options is the answer, it's reducing the amount of junk in there to a livable limit for her age so she isn't getting overwhelmed.

You sound very stressed by all of the items in your daughter's room, and so does your daughter.

My son is four, and here are some things I learned as a nanny that help with kids of all ages...

1. Until they don't want your help/company when cleaning their room, do offer it. Kids sometimes get very overwhelmed with the sheer enormity of 'all the stuff' and need us to 'break it down' for the. I'd make a plan you can even put on some cardstock and hang in her room to help her. Something along the lines of "1. Gather up all the clothes. Dirty ones go in the hall to laundry. Clean ones are folded and put away. 2. Gather up all the dolls and doll clothes. 3. Markers, paper, books: place in a pile and sort for home or school. Home artwork goes in X, school books go back in backpack" etc.

2. Clean out the room. Have her choose a reasonable (meaning managable) amount of toys to have in her room and put the rest in storage elsewhere. When she wants to play with a stored toy, have her 'trade out' something else so that you aren't constantly beseiged with toys. I rotate my son's toys-- and initiated this with my families for their children. Everyone was much happier. If there are some collections that are used constantly but overwhelming in mass (say, dress-up clothes) pare through and keep some favorites, then store the rest.

3. Clean up twice a day, or allow a longer clean-up time. Especially in summer, you might consider doing a big clean-up late morning/early afternoon and one later in the day, say before dinner. Trying to have kids clean their rooms after dinner, right before bed, is getting them at their most tired and during one of the most fraught and challenging transition times:bedtime.

4. Label her storage with clear icons or pictures. Do this with shelves too.

5. Be routine in helping her and keep working backward. That is, if she feels that she doesn't *want* to pick up her barbies, then they are removed for a while. I do this with my son; I just explain that "if you choose not to take care of X, then I will put it away for a while". This, to me, is different than punishing or saying "you can't play with it", and wording is crucial to this exchange, in my opinion. We want our children to understand that having less in their space can be *helpful* to them, and is desirable, not punitive.

Lastly, please don't cancel her birthday party. I know you are frustrated, and we must consider the response that will come with that. Do you think your daughter will be more willing to listen because you deprived her of her special day, or become angry and hurt? I only ask this because this is obviously a challenge she is having trouble managing. Your daughter did tell you her room was spotless (to her) but you didn't check, from the sounds of it. I'd make a point on NOT taking her word for it, but everytime (at least once a day), to say "let's go take a look at your room" and do the parental follow-through on getting a cleanliness status. I've learned the hard way that kids will just say "oh it's clean/done" to get on to the next thing. For example, when I've sent my son to wash his hands and I'm unsure it's been done, I don't ask him *if* he's washed his hands, I tell him "Bring me your hands, sweets. Oh, looks like they didn't get washed! Off you go. Don't come out until they're clean!" and move him back to what he needs to do. Even big 8 year old girls do need us to check in on them often, because obviously your daughter's perception of clean (which sounds like she really doesn't care one way or the other ) isn't the same as yours.

Good luck!

I think it's too late to cancel the party. That is a life event that should not be a reward for doing work.

I think she needs to have rewards for accomplishments. She needs to have consequences for not doing her jobs too. But in the long run it's her room. If you don't like it shut the door and move on.

Peer pressure will make her ashamed and she'll eventually start cleaning it if she has the skills taught to her.

Start minimizing toys. She is at that stage where the older toys will be easily parted with. If she has too many clothes go through them and pass them to a friend or donate them. She needs to be part of the process and it may take all Summer. Work a half hour a day sorting through things and have boxs labeled for things, give to XXX, give to Cousin XXX, donate to Goodwill, winter clothes for Fall 2011 and Winter 2012. We spend a week each Spring and Fall taking out the off season clothes and trying on the stored clothes and organizing them. It is easier for our girls to keep her clothes manageable this way. Plus I don't have arguments about wearing flip flops on snow days, they are put up and stored.

I have the flat tubs that fit under beds under our boys bed but under the girls daybed I have taller tubs made by Rubbermaid. They are the perfect height and I can just write on them. I have a dust ruffle and out of sight often means out of mind.

My friend has never sat and taught her kids how to clean. They have no idea how to organize a room to clean it. They just sit there and cry saying they don't know what to do. She tells them over and over, pick up all the books and put them up, then pick up all the clean clothes and put them back in their homes, then put the dirty clothes in the hamper, of course every piece of clothing they own is out of the closet and on the floor. In my opinion they are dirty and need to be rewashed but they live out in the country and their play clothes are always dirty.

Kids cannot think in the abstract. They have to have more concrete instructions until they are more adolescents. Make a cleaning list and plst it somewhere like inside the closer door.

1. Pick up all the books and put them on the shelves, standing up.

2. Pick up all the clothes, take the hangers out of them and put the hangers back in the closet, put the dirty clothes in the hamper, when hamper is full get a laundry basket and fill it up. Take all to the laundry room.

3. Take all Polly Pocket dolls and put them in their bin/tub/bucket, put all accessories in their home too. What ever her biggest, messiest toys are might go here instead.

4. Gather all the Barbie dolls and put them in the door hanger. Put all the Barbie clothes in the Barbie bin/tub/storage place.

5. Take any dishes back to the kitchen, run hot water in them and let them soak.

Add more and more smaller jobs here. She needs steps and the ability to accomplish things to feel good and feel like she is able.

Have some sort of reward system, even just in your mind, to let her know you noticed what she has done, every step needs a high five, a sticker, a snuggle, a pop or granola bar (we call them candy bars), something to show you noticed and she has accomplished a task. She'll start learning too and be able to clean when she is older and has her own home.

Final step, run vacuum or sweep then take trash out to the big garbage can in the garage.

Have a set day for her to change her sheets and bedding. Plan on her helping and then she'll start learning how to do laundry herself too. Of course that's another 10-15 steps of learning a task, like reading labels to make sure it's even washable. Figuring out how to sort colors and learning to understand the weights of fabrics, for example don't wash white towels with black hose and turtle necks...we love the white fuzzies on the black stuff Right???? I also don't wash denim with light weight materials. It chews the lighter stuff up and spits them out yucky.

Hi, this is a battel you have to win together. You say your mom bought her storage stuff. Does she have a lot of stuff? Do you know how overwhelming it can be when you have a big mess to clean. What I suggest is to clean with her and play music. You need to show her where her toys go and teach her how to clean. You can't expect them to know and at this age you have to teach them a place for everything. I have a 7 year old and its hard for her but since I have done this with my 10 year old she no longer needs my help. If she has alot of stuff, put some away, give some away to goodwill, and leave some in her room. Every birthday and holiday get rid of some toys and keep the rest. Kids these days get alot and it teaches them to think of others when they give their toys away. Also, the clothes keep summer clothes out for summer and put the winter clothes away expcet for a few pants and a jacket. The best thing I can say is to also teach her how to put the clothes away. It is so rewarding when you teach them how to fold their own clothes and put them away. Good luck, you can train a messy person to be clean but you will have to work it, its a lot like potty training. They need you alot in the begining and in the end they don't need you anymore and you will be so much more happy:)

Do not cancel her birthday party over this. It's not like she murdered someone, she has a messy room.

Help her get and stay organized. Make a list of what she needs to do every day. Make bed, fold clothes, put toys in bins, put books on shelf, etc.

If she's like my daughters, she changes her clothes 5 times a day and drops it all on the floor. If they clothes are not dirty, have her fold them and put them away. You might have to do this twice a day. Make her put stuff away before she takes something else out.

Also, go through her stuff and make sure you throw away anything that's broken or soiled beyond repair. Go through her toys and clothes and box up anything she hasn't played with or worn in awhile or clothes that don't fit.

Room clean up is a daily thing, not a weekly thing. Good luck!

She's 8, you don't cancel an 8yo's party.

It takes a lot of work raising kids the way you want them to be. My mom always expected us to keep our rooms clean and we knew to keep them clean. If we didn't keep them clean, she would be constantly harping on us, so therefore it was just easier to clean our rooms. Clean room, or constant nagging, harping & bitching?? Most of the time I chose a clean room. :)

You don't mention how old she is. But I discovered, the hard way, that until they were around 10, my kids were not really able to clean their room independently. It was just too overwhelming for them! (Even now, I'll "inspect" and point out what needs to happen next). So if you're sending her to her room to clean by herself, there's a good chance you're expecting too much out of her.
Trust me, I know how much of a hassle it is to sit with a kid for 3 hours and help them clean (even if you're just giving directions). But this isn't something kids learn on their own, really. My strategy lately (with almost 8 year old and 10 year old who share a room) is to assign each one a task: pick up dirty laundry for one, pick up all the papers for the other. Then they each get a new task.

That said, since you've made a threat, you probably should follow through. Have you told her you would cancel the party? I did that once. I kept telling my daughter if she kept sassing me and acting mean to her brothers I would cancel her b-day party. She kept it up, and I cancelled the party! No scaring, but she did learn that I meant what I said! I've also bagged up everything in my boys' room before and they had to earn things back. (Do keep in mind that, depending on age, she may have legitimately thought it was cleaner than what you saw ... again, we have to teach them what a clean room looks like)

Do the trash bag, but don't toss it.

Put it in your closet and every day inspect her room before bed. Each day it passes, let her pick out 1 thing from the closet and put that away. I am betting she is overwhelmed and doesn't really know where to start so she doesn't.

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My daughter is 10 and even at that age when things get too big and out of control they cant keep up. You need to start slower with her. At 8 she was expected to make her bed every day and put her clean clothes I washed away. Then for stuff on the floor I'd pick them up and hand it to her and say please put this here. They need to learn how to organize and get things put away. OMG do not stop her birthday party. Now at 10 I can have her help clean up the living room and the kitchen even because I've slowly introduced how you clean things up and what is expected so it becomes second nature

Ah, the moat! When my daughter was young, her floor was covered! She is now a mom of 2, herself.) We called her floor the moat around her bed.

At this age, you will need to help her and guide her. It will be an overwhelming task for her alone and at 7 and 8, (and 12, etc. ) you need to be teaching her how to clean it and it break it into small tasks. "Let's put away all the doll clothes today." They'll all be back in an hour, but she can practice doing that every day before getting ready for bed. Sometimes, sticker charts help with rewards for whatever part she accomplishes. It will require your help for a number of years. (We still have to teach middle school students how to organize a notebook, how to study, etc.)

Because you will decided which battles are most important as she gets older, choose carefully. I received wise advice from a neighbor. Close the door. I did take it one more step. I insisted that there be a clear direct path from the door to her her bed for emergencies. (Her "bridge") She could only have friends in her room if it was relatively picked up ( no clothes on floor and a reasonable amount was cleared for them to play.) Because she liked having her friends here, she was willing pick up a good part of it routinely. And, yes, sometimes, toys went away for awhile. Limit the amount of things in her room. It'll help!

We did take pictures - she laughs now. But it wasn't worth a fight every week. I stressed ME not her because she didn't care. As a working mom, didn't need more stress. That was our compromise.

I won't claim it'll work for all - but think about your priorities. What is most important? I'm blessed because my daughter lives close enough to come visit a few times a week. I love being a grandmother! We have fun taking the kids places together - or just visiting.

PS "The moat" did not exist her in her college dorm - or apartment. Her husband is really neat!

I have read some of the responses which are good. I would add two things: (1) Pick your battles. The dirty room bugs you, not her. She has virtually NO control over anything in her life; this is one thing she can control - I encourage you to let her. She's the one that has to live in it, not you. As she gets older, you will have many more important battles to battle. I face a similar problem with 2 teen girls. I have struggled to let it go and am doing better. That said, when we are having company (or there is some other compelling reason to have a clean house), I give them 4 or 5 days notice and tell them (calmly): "if you don't clean it, I will - YOUR choice." This means shoving everything into large trash bags and throwing it in the closet. They don't like this. They are teens, so this tactic is not appropriate for an 8-year old - I like the suggestions of teaching her how to clean and REWARDS for doing so. (2) Encourage you to make consequences relevant and respectful. Threatening to cancel a party is not relevant to a clean room. Not buying any new clothes (or toys or whatever) until the room is clean for a week is relevant since there is nowhere to put something new until the old stuff is put away/given away. To this day when either girls gives me a bag of clothes for Good Will, i will buy them on new thing that they want (they pay for all their own clothes so this is a big deal). And it's an incentive, not a "punishment." So..."when your room is clean for a week straight without me nagging you, you can get that new top you want; right now, there's no room for it". SOmething like that.

She's young - be her coach. Encourage her. Get on your hands and knees on her bedroom floor with her and with a trash bag (or two), some hangers, play some music she likes and have fun. I wish I had done more of this! Good luck.

I guess there wont be any room for the new gifts that she gets for her birthday. I say you make her keep all her new things in their original packaging until she brings her room up to par and then she can go ahead and find a clean and organized spot for all her new things in her room. Im sure that will get her butt in gear to want to clean her room. I would think any child would go stir crazy looking at all their new toys and not being able to play with them
Good Luck

My daughter is almost 6 y/o... I understand 8 years old is a bit more mature, but I still think very similar in maturity. I would expect my child at that age to pick up her room, but not to really organize and clean it - I think that's still the parent's job until the child is mature enough to understand what is expected and able to follow it thru. My daughter gets overwhelmed if I ask her to do smaller certain things (like get ALL your shoes from the whole house and put them in the shoe shelves... after 2 pairs she gets frustrated), so I know she's got awhile til she's ready.

Relax, it's only a messy room. Close the door and don't look. Seriously, both my girls are messy. They must help keep the main areas of the house clean, but their bedrooms are their space and not up to my standards at all. But you know, they are comfortable in there.

I do have a total "for health reasons" clean up ocasionally to get everything out of the room and have them do a thorough cleaning .

Otherwise Mom, pick your battles, save the outrage for rally important issues.

flylady.net has a friend for children. Can't think of the name right now, some sort of Fairy. Flylady used to have tons of wonderful hints for helping children on the website, the Fairy was something that you could pay a bit for and they would guide you as the parent through a reward baseded systen that the kids could handle and learn to clean independently. I think my kids are old enough now that i might go back and revisit that.

Lots of great advice, but my biggest thing is that you need to sit with her and really purge alot. I feel you have almost gone overboard with it, but you do need to cut back the amount of clothing and toys if she can't keep it organized. for me I need a routine for pickign up and i need storage that is EASY to put things back into. elaborate storage that is hard to open or isnt' the right size doesnt' get used.
good luck

My kids tend toward being messy as well. However, starting when my oldest was about 4, I made a rule that if she couldn't pick it up on her own, it went AWAY. At first, things went away for a day or so (in a trash bag in the garage, but she didn't know that). After that, it went away, as in it went in the trash. My reasoning with her was that if she didn't love her toys enough to respect and take care of them (i.e. putting them away when she was done playing with them), then she didn't really need them.

And then aside from that, she just had WAY too many toys. Honestly, kids don't need every toy in the world to be happy. I think they are happier when they pick and choose what they REALLY want. To that end, we went through her toys and cleared out everything she hadn't played with in a while. We donated it to Goodwill, and in return I gave her $20. Then, every toy she asked for, I'd say, well, that toy costs $15 out of your $20. Are you sure that's what you want? And she'd think about it and decide... no, maybe she didn't want it *that* badly. Basically, she had to decide and take responsibility for the toys she wanted, budget for them, etc. Now at 8.5 years old, her room is always clean because she only has toys she LOVES and has bought herself, and she knows that if I find things all over the floor, her toys are going to be thrown out.

I am training my 6 year old the same way. Her room tends to get a little more out of hand, but once I point it out to her, she can get it cleaned up in 5 minutes or so (so I guess her room isn't THAT messy, LOL).

Good luck!

When my daughter was 9 we followed through with the threat to take everything away. We packed up boxes and moved them in a moving truck to a storage space. She was left with what she needed.

In the end, she didn't miss it. We were stuck paying the bill on a storage unit.

It seems that she had outgrown most of the things. They were only there because I couldn't get rid of them. I am terrible at purging. I was teaching her to be a hoarder.

Now her room has less stuff and she seems happy. She's still upset that we took all of her things away. I don't think we've scarred her in any way.

Even now at 11, we still have to remind her daily to pick up her room. She has a checklist of daily things. We let her create the list. No reward for completing it. Just that she has to do those things everyday. Most days we still have to remind her to brush her teeth.

I didn't read your prior posts but I will give you my 2 cents. My dtr is 11. She used to be the same way and really still kind of is. The big difference is that I have DOWNSIZED her stuff tremendously, and that has made a huge difference. She doesn't need "tons" of storage. If she is like any typical kid, she doens't even KNOW half the stuff that's in her room, let alone appreciate and play with it. So take a weekend, tell her you BOTH are going to get rid of stuff and do it. Have a big trash can and a big bag (or several) for goodwill. Just throw stuff in there. I have a plastic storage unit for her that's on wheels and has 3 drawers. That is where all her stuff goes. She also has a bookcase that only has binders and books in it. She has a dresser that has clothes and 2 nightstands that have art supplies and CD's and some misc things. She also has only TEN stuffed animals that she picked out. Most of the time she has them on her bed but she has a big basket that she throws them in when she "cleans" her room. My hubby and I have started recently to take 10-15 min every night and help the kids "clean" their rooms. Each of us stand in there with them and point and say "put that there, but that in there...etc". That way they see what is out and WHERE it should go. Hopefully they will be able to do this on their own someday! But now it looks like a kids room but I'm not horrified but it anymore! It really helps to get rid of stuff. Good luck.

I was that kid. Actually I'm still kinda that kid. lol! Of course my house isn't nearly as bad as my room was as a kid. I've outgrown most of it. My take on the situation is as long as you can close her door and don't have to look (and it's not growing anything or has bugs etc) at it let it go. She's either going through a phase or this is just who she is and no matter how much you make her clean it she won't ever learn to be neat.

I would explain to her in a way she can understand what your concern is, that you're afraid she won't be able to get out of her room safely in case of an emergency. Maybe set up some areas of her room that can be messy as long as she leaves her escape route clean. When I was her age everyone kept telling me that my room was a fire hazard. I had NO IDEA what that meant. I thought that if I moved my 500 NKOTB magazines farther away from the door it wouldn't be a hazard anymore. It wasn't until I was much older that I understood what they were saying. Had they just explained things to me in a way I could understand I would've taken care of it. I also didn't respond well (still don't) to being bossed around. If someone had ASKED me to clean up my room and explained exactly how they wanted it done and made me feel like I was doing them a favor I definitely would've done it.

I know how tough it is when you make a threat to your kid and don't really want to follow through. I've made that mistake before too. Tough spot. Just do what's right for you guys. If you decide not to cancel her party you may want to explain why you didn't so she doesn't think you make empty threats. Good luck!

You've received some very good advice. It is your house and you certainly have the right to have expectations of her.

My question to you is: Have you given her guidance on how to clean her room? Seriously, if she doesn't know how to do it it may be overwhelming for her. Go in the room, pick a spot to start and tell her what you want her to do. Stay in the room from start to finish, help a little, but have her do the majority of the work so she'll remember what to do. Have her throw away trash, go through clothing and toys and give away/throw away whatever she's outgrown or doesn't need. Have her straighten her closet (maybe she can put things away in there to unclutter the room) make her bed, and vacuum the carpet. Have her decide where she wants to store stuff in the storage things your mom bought her for her room, but remember, that stuff will come out of the totes, etc., and then it will be on the floor. Maybe she just needs less stuff in her room, rather than lots of storage to keep it in. Tell her if she keeps it neat and clean on a daily basis, puts things away, tosses trash, etc., she won't have to do major cleaning like this again.

Take a picture of the room clean and show it to her (print it out if possible to post on her wall) and tell her when she cleans her room, this is how you want it to look.

In the future, don't take her word that it's "spotless," check it out yourself. You really don't know what it looked like last night. Keeping on top of it will let her know she HAS to keep it clean.
Have you thought of giving her a way to earn an outfit or pair of pj's back, say, 3 days of a clean and neat room earns an outfit back? You know your daughter best, do what you feel will work for her to take you seriously.

And, because it's an expectation you have of her, come up with a consequence for when it doesn't get cleaned properly. A lost privilege like no TV that night, no sleepover, etc., on top of getting it cleaned.

Hang in there : )

Stick to your guns on this one!!!! My stepson never had any follow through or punishment from his parents, my husband included, and he is the biggest slob - I'm talking dirty slob. I hate to say it but it's true. I have found dirty, moldy food containers that he has hidden all over the house b/c he doesn't want to make the effort to take the dish back to the kitchen (and b/c he is not supposed to eat food anywhere but the kitchen or dining room). I constantly find his dirty, smelly socks shoved everywhere - couch cushions, behind furniture, in the desk drawers, under the fridge - again too lazy to take his socks with him to his room when he goes. His clothes are always a mess, drawers open w/stuff falling out, wrappers, trash and gum everywhere (his mother gives it to him by the load), his stuff is always strewn all through the house, he drops his stuff in front of the door when he gets home from school and we end up tripping on it and having to push it out of the way just to open the door when we get home... And don't even get me started on his bathroom - it's scary! At one point we took away everything but the furniture and his clothes and he still made a mess and didn't care. Don't let it get to this point!!! Do what you have to NOW!!!