Are "Good" Alcoholics Still Alcoholics?

http://www.alcoholism-and-drug-addiction-help.com/definit...

"Alcoholism is a primary illness or disorder characterised by some loss of control over drinking, with habituation or addiction to the drug alcohol, causing interference in any major life function, e.g. health, family, job, spiritual, friends,legal."

http://www.step12.com/alcoholics-definition.html

That's called being a functioning alcoholic. I know someone like this. His wife has struggled for years with his problem. He is mellow and sweet when he drinks but completely useless, just sits in front of the TV until he passes out. She keeps saying she's going to leave him (she hardly drinks at all) but after 25 years of marriage I don't see it happening.

Seeing he has admitted he has a problem (which is the necessary step 1 to getting help, now AA and Alanon for you and counsiling. You could even possably do Rehab for de-toxing

My Dad is the nicest person when he is drinking; however, he drinks to deal some emotional stress and that is an alcoholic thru and thru , it does not matter if they are a nice drunk or a nasty drunk if they cannot control their drinking they have a problem and need help.

The best thing you can do is to educate yourself. YOU should start attending Al-Anon meetings. They are eveyrwhere...churches, schools, libraries, community centers, etc.

Tell your family doctor about your husband's alcoholism, as they will be able to provide resources as well.

Make your husband get his liver levels checked NOW. I'm positive it will already start to show severe damage with the kind of drinking you are describing. If he won't stop due to your own observations, maybe he'll stop if he see's the test results and the doc can explain how much longer his liver can hold out.

This was a brave first step, asking moms here. But now you need to seek real help, because the day is likely to come where he won't change and you have to make a tougher decision than Al-Anon meetings.

Hi Sweettooth, my ex husband drank exactly the way you say your husband drinks. In the begining. Well for YEARS. But then it started to escalate.

It got way worse when things started looking up for us financially. He is a very succesful corporate executive who is extremely good at his job.

On weekends, he drinks. Towards the end, he drank 2-3 cases of beer each day Fri, Sat, Sun (no exaggeration). Needless to say, he was not himself by the time Sunday rolled around. Furthermore, since he traveled extensively he considered himself 'at work' at all times during the week and his DTs were AWFUL. Fridays were the best day, since after 3 days the DTs were wearing off, plus he knew he'd be home to drink all weekend.

I spent the majority of the two years we built our gorgeous new house in my oldest sons room with the door locked, with him outside the door knocking softly, 'c'mon I just want to TALK! Why are you so mean to me?' And the like. He became paranoid and abusive.

I hid his beer. I poured it down the sink. I called members of his family to try to get them to help, but since they ALL grew up in a house with extreme alcoholism, they ALL felt I was overreating.

He would not go see anyone. He would also willingly admit to ME that he drank too much. With the wave of his hand, like, yeah, you're right, I drink too much, whatever.

He would not leave. I left with the kids. I was open and honest with my plans to leave. I reminded him of the date. At no time did he say he would try to stop....until MOVING day, my entire family was there helping me move, he sat on the stairs sobbing, he could not believe I wouldn't give him a break. Those were his words. "Can't you ever give me a fucking break?!' no kidding. We left him there in the giant gorgeous brand new house sobbing on the seven thousand dollar red oak staircase.

Anyway.....point being, like Grandma T said,he didn't start out as a mean drunk, how will it be after a few more years, a few more stresses?

HTH!

:)

It's a progressive disease; meaning he may only get drunk on Saturday nights right now but it will become more frequent as he gets older. If it's a problem for you then it's a problem.

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Being dependent on alcohol is still an alcoholic regardless of how they behave when they are drunk.
AA says even if they recognize they have a problem and abstain they are still alcoholics but they are called recovering alcoholics - it's always something they have to be careful of.
There are happy drunks and violent drunks, and there are people who can act totally normal while drunk but will experience Delirium Tremens (the DTs) if they stop drinking.

There are questions to help determine if alcohol has become a problem:

Are You an Alcoholic?

To answer this question, ask yourself the following questions and answer them as honestly as you can.

1. Do you lose time from work due to your drinking?
2. Is drinking making your home life unhappy?
3. Do you drink because you are shy with other people?
4. Is drinking affecting your reputation?
5. Have you ever felt remorse after drinking?
6. Have you gotten into financial difficulties as a result of your drinking?
7. Do you turn to lower companions and an inferior environment when drinking?
8. Does your drinking make you careless of your family's welfare?
9. Has your ambition decreased since drinking?
10. Do you crave a drink at a definite time daily?
11. Do you want a drink the next morning?
12. Does drinking cause you to have difficulty in sleeping?
13. Has your efficiency decreased since drinking?
14. Is drinking jeopardizing your job or business?
15. Do you drink to escape from worries or troubles?
16. Do you drink alone?
17. Have you ever had a complete loss of memory as a result of your drinking?
18. Has your physician ever treated you for drinking?
19. Do you drink to build up your self-confidence?
20. Have you ever been in a hospital or institution on account of drinking?

If you have answered YES to any one of the questions, there is a definite warning that you may be an alcoholic.

If you have answered YES to any two, the chances are that you are an alcoholic.

If you have answered YES to three or more, you are definitely an alcoholic.

I believe the term is 'functioning alcoholic'. Meaning, you can go about your day to day roles. It can still affect physical health, and the need can be psychological and/or physical.

Oh, you asked a question for me, it would seem.

My husband drinks every night. Five or six bears, and not 3.2, either...it used to be he would drink 2 or 3 of these 20 oz. 10% beers, and eventually he switched to 5 or 6 6% beers, and now he's down to 5 or 6 4/5% beers.

It bothers me because it's a waste of what little leftover money we have, and it's bad for his health. He's overweight, and that's the ONLY reason...he eats healthy, gets exercise, but when I think about how many calories and how much sugar he's packing in every night, I shudder.

The drinking itself doesn't bother me very much...he's not mean, doesn't act stupid, and doesn't drink until all the children are asleep. If one of them gets up in the middle of the night, he is fully capable of helping, which just makes me sad that he's got such a tolerance. Still...

I wish he didn't do it. But this is a lament of my life. I convinced him to stop for about a week, once, and it just felt so GOOD that he wasn't drinking.

It's hard to explain to anyone who doesn't live in this situation.

A "nice" drunk will die of cirrhosis just as quickly as a "mean" drunk.

Yes - still alcoholics. More tolerable than a mean and nasty drunk, but still drunk and not a great candidate for a relationship. I seriously dated someone like this, and I LOVED him like crazy. He was fun and passionate and affectionate when he was drunk and quiet and reserved and detached sober. Things could never be quite right - when he was sober, he couldnt deal with emotions and simple every day conflict or tension - like who would do the dishes or why my feelings were hurt that he spent all night on the computer instead of talking with me.

He also had a daughter from a previous relationship. He never drank when she was awake, but would drink heavily after she went to bed. What would he do if there was an emergency in the night? A fire and he is passed out? She is sick and needs to go to the hospital? Or even just had a bad dream?

So I think even good alcoholics suffer from a disease that hurts themselves and those close to them.

Edit to add: Just read your So What Happened - sounds very similar to my former fiance. He held a good job and always went to work sober and stayed sober all day. But we had garbage bags filled with beer bottles we took out every couple of days. He called me once late at night from a business trip - crying that he was a motherf***** alcoholic and needed to stop. After I got off the phone, I stayed up all night crying. When I picked him up at the airport the next day, he acted like the conversation never took place. After we broke up, he got treatment (not because of me, because he was ready) and when I saw him a couple of years later, he told me that he was sober and had been for 3 years.

I'm very sad for you. I know it is heartbreaking and harder even then a violent drunk. But he needs to get help.

People can really get used to ANYTHING. The worst thing, if repeated long enough and with consistency, ends up feeling *normal*. It's "normal" that a parent gets drunk EVERY DAY, consistently losing his ability to respond in a healthy manner to whatever need may arise in his household.It's "normal" for a wife to see her husband losing himself in the isolation and numbness alcohol provides. It's "normal" for her to feel de-valued, unimportant, lonely, scared. It's "normal" to pretend all is under control because his behavior is "normal" and to wipe her healthy doubts, fears and expectations under an imaginary rug. There's nothing good or "nice" about addiction, no matter how "weak" it appears to be. I would keep trying helping him overcome his problem, and he can't deny either, just save up the empty bottles he gulps every month and see how many those end up to be - a huge amount. Some things are just not "normal", you need to talk to a doctor and take action for the sake of all family. Just my kids eventually witnessing that alone will be more than enough for me to find an immediate solution, I can't imagine seeing my loved one turn into that "drunk" every day.Good luck.

Yes, if someone is a "nice drunk" they are still a drunk, IMO. My dad is a nice drunk, always fun to be around, cheerful, happy, a great time, etc., but he is still an alcoholic. My dad has gone years without a drink, but when he goes back to drinking, he GOES BACK TO DRINKING, if you get my drift. It is sad to see someone I love and have looked up to destroying their body, and risking their families for a drink or 2, or 10.

Hi Sweet Tooth.
My father was an alchoholic.
My mother had an addictive personality of some sort.

Alchoholism like diabetes is a sickness and needs to be treated. There is no shame in that. Even if the person's good character remains in tact while drunk, that person still needs help.

I wish both of my parents had had the courage to seek the help they needed. My father might still be alive (he was depressed in addition to his alchoholism and the combination....) and my mother might have at least been 'present' for me...emotionally etc....

I hope this helps.
Jilly

After reading your update, I would say yes that might be a problem. At first, I was going to say no, because I, myself, have a few drinks almost daily but I do not consider myself an alcoholic. It's how I relax in the evenings but it does not interruprt my normal life. And it is not a problem with my SO. He's not really a drinker. He might have one drink a week.
If your husband does this frequently and he thinks he is an alcoholic, then yes - I would say it is a problem whether he is a nice drunk or a mean drunk.
I hope things get better!

Yes.

My BIL was a binge drinker for years and years. He didn't drink every day but when he did drink it was always excessive. When my SIL finally got fed up and left, he took a nosedive and it ultimately lead to his death.

If you *have* to have a drink, then you are addicted.

I had a college roommate who didn't think she was drunk til she was sick, but of course she was drunk long before that. Her perception was wrong. Even if the person only drinks to excess once a week, once a week EVERY week is an unhealthy pattern. If once they start drinking they are not likely to stop (no one glass of wine with dinner), that is addictive/abusive.

People self-medicate for many reasons. For example, those with ADHD may find a drink calming. But it doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.

Those nights he is drunk also mean that he cannot support you with your children. Is he drinking when they are up? Is he unable to help if in the middle of the night one is sick? Is he unable to get up and get them off to school?

If he is so drunk he is peeing on the kitchen floor and doesn't know it, that's bad. What if the kids heard and saw their dad doing that? How would you and he feel? His reaction that he's just like his dad means, IMO, that he has unresolved issues about his dad he needs to address. He needs to get help. You should seek out AlAnon for help for yourself.

Beyond mental health, frequent binge drinking does not help the body, either.

Yes... Still an alcoholic, still a problem, still needs to be addressed. I'd be willing to bet that if you really took a close look at your husband's drinking you would find that even though he is not violent or a "mean" drunk his drinking is negatively affecting your life, his life and the lives of your kids.

I would also venture to guess that the drinking will progress to an unacceptable level in a short period of time.It may be a health condition that develops or any number of other behavioral things.

I would seek help... and soon.

Sorry J. V. your information is not correct. An alcoholic's drinking patterns can present in any number of ways. It does not have to be every day and it does not have to be in large quantities, although what you describe is certainly alcoholism and an extreme case of it.

I can see how it's easier to overlook, but yep, still a problem. It's not healthy for them, or their sig others. And because their inhibitions are lowered, they are much more likely to do something like drive drunk or something else destructive. I know it can be tempting to overlook, but doing so doesn't do anyone any favors.

I would think that if a person were actually nicer and cooler when they were drunk, then they were self medicating an emotional problem. If you aren't happy sober then you aren't truly happy, are you?

If that's the case then the addiction needs to be treated and the pain needs to be healed and coping mechanisms for pain need to be built, or that person would never know true joy, just the facade of joy brought on by the over consumption of alcohol.

Why trade in the real deal for a fake?

Alcoholism is about addiction, not about temperament. If I'm hooked on something, I'm hooked on it when I'm smiling as well as when I'm frowning or yelling.

I understand, though. When people are nice to get along with, why rock the boat?

Because it's still an addiction. It's still affecting me physically, it still affects my behavior and my decision-making even if I'm nice about it, and it's still affecting the people around me.

I'm with you on this question. I'm related to alcoholics. I "dabbled" in college, but decided that I never wanted to fall into that hole and that I wanted to set my own family a better example. As Katherine Hepburn reputedly said, "Cold sober, I find myself fascinating!"

P.S. Just read your "So What Happened?" section. Call AlAnon.

an alcoholic drinks everyday. They may never get drunk, but they need it to function. Someone who drinks once or twice a week is not an alcoholic. Drinking to intoxication 1-2 times a week is someone who likes to be drunk, not someone who has an addiction. If they are refusing to give it up, it may be because they like it and don't see the need to.

So, your problem is more with the fact that they are drunk at all ? I am not saying you are wrong in any way, everyone feels differently about drinking. Some are very much against it, some embrace it as "fun & entertainment". I know people who get drunk, or highly tipsy, keep alcohol in the house all the time (never drive drunk, get mean, etc.). I guess I wouldn't consider them addicted, they just enjoy getting drunk once a week, and otherwise live productive lives. I myself drink several times a week (a glass of wine, an occasional martini). I don't get falling down drunk, but I occasionally get tipsy. I guess it depends on if it affects others, especially your significant others. If they are drinking until incapacitation, then I think that would be worrisome, but not just silly drunkeness. If they can carry on a conversation and put themselves to bed, shouldn't really be all that concerning.

I *highly* recommend the book, "In the Realm of Hungry Ghosts," by Gabor Mate, MD. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_1_11?url=search-al...
It is a book that gives a most comprehensive description and understanding of addiction - medically, psychologically, and internally. An *amazing* book.

Addiction is, in MY mind, not defined by quantity or by regularity of use. In my mind, there is no simple equation that allows us to know if someone else is/is not an addict. It's really up to them to determine that for themselves. That's not to say we don't get to identify behaviors, or to set healthy boundaries for ourselves.

I've known (self identified) alcoholics who drank once every few weeks. I've known (self identified) alcoholics who drank all day, every day. I've known alcoholics who were mean when they drank, who lost their families, who lost their jobs, and I've known alcoholics who got promotions during active addiction and who were nicer when drinking. In my mind, addiction is about the hunger, the obsession, the need for something external. It's about the way our brains relate to dopamine, and about how we cope with stimulation/trauma.

All of that to say, I don't think there is one answer to "what is alcoholism". If your husband is an alcoholic? That's for him to decide. What your husband decides to do with this is ultimately up to him. Now, that's not to say that you have to/will be fine with what he decides. Rather, it's not your responsibility to make that set of choices FOR him. It's your responsibility to make those choices for yourself.

For example: "It bothers me when they get drunk". I don't get to make sure my spouses doesn't use / or to decide what is a problem for HIM, but I do think I get to my own boundaries.

For example, *I* don't (often) feel good when I choose to be around drunk folks. *I* don't feel good when I'm around heavy drinking, so I choose not to be around it. Then again, my boundaries are fluid. I chose to spend time with my dad a few weeks ago, even though he was drinking. My choice. I chose to go out dancing with some girlfriends and we went to the bar strip to do so. My choice. I have done some harm reduction advocacy and would be around addicted populations. My choice. When I choose not to be around someone who is drinking, it has *everything* to do with me, and zero to do with them (unless they are crossing my boundaries after I've clearly stated and acted on them).

I'll give you a silly example. I hate the color beige. I mean, I really despise it. I don't get to make everyone else stop wearing beige, but I do get to decide that the color doesn't make it's way into my closet, and I do get to decide that I don't decorate in beige. I get to decide what is problematic for ME, and I get to have fluid boundaries.

I've chosen not to have an active relationship with my (actively addicted) sister. I don't like being around her. She gets to do what she wants, but she doesn't get to bring it into my life, because I've set boundaries. (I really love my sister, BTW.) I have chosen to keep our relationship at arms length because it feels damaging to have too much contact with her. On the other hand, I will write her occasionally, and today I will call the hospital to see if she's there - so it's fluid. And, I'm still learning ;-)

I choose to have a relationship with my (actively addicted) Dad. It's worth it to me, and I don't mind being around him when he's drinking. I don't have to have my kids around him when he's drinking. That's also up to me.

I choose to have a relationship with my (not actively using) husband. I chose not to be in a relationship with my husband when he's using, because I despise being around him when he's using.

Heck, it doesn't have to be substances, it can be behaviors. I don't have to be around a girlfriend of mine when she's controlling the whole darn world. I don't have to be around anyone whom I don't want. There are options. They may still be part of my life (my sister for example) but I don't need to invite them into my home, or my everyday life.

My suggestion, from my own POV, is that you may find relief if you don't try to determine what his path looks like. Rather than, "you should go to rehab / AA / outpatient", you might choose to say, "I feel _______ (sad, scared, annoyed, frustrated, X,Y,Z) when you drink. I don't want to be around you when you are drinking," or, "You communicated that you identify as an alcoholic. You have told me that you want to quit drinking and are not able to do it by yourself. Are you willing to try something different and would you like my help researching some of those options?" or, "While I feel glad to hear that you would like to quit drinking, I know I'm not the best person to help support you and know that I won't be able to support you as much as you may need. I am too personally invested in what you end up doing, and may force my ideas on you. Instead, I'm going to distance myself a bit so that I don't make decisions to control your behavior." or, "I feel fine with you drinking," or, "I don't want to be in a marriage with someone who identifies as alcoholic," or any number of "I statements" that may feel right for you.

12 step programs have been successful and are a good fit for a LOT of people. There are other options too. If he chooses to go to AA or if you choose to go to al-anon or ACOA (depending on how you identify), I suggest going to lots of different meetings. Try 'em on, and don't be afraid to keep on looking. Lot's of folks get a lot of relief from working the steps and getting a sponsor.

Good luck and big hugs.

PS, don't forget self care! Hot baths, tea, time away with your support system, good novels, journaling, exercise, rest/relaxation and the right kinds of food/liquids - just to name a few that help some people.